From WILL - Focus -

Meth Use On the Rise Again in Illinois

Michael Pasley was arrested 3 years ago when his meth lab was raided, he says it was more of a rescue than it was anything else. He’d been awake for 22 days straight when authorities caught him.


(Duration: 51:23)

Michael Pasley

Michael Pasley Darrell Hoemann

Five years ago, meth arrests were as low as they had ever been in Illinois with right around 400 seizures per year. This year, however, authorities expect nearly twice that many. Even though national rates of meth usage are down, it’s on the rise in east central Illinois. The state had the fifth most methamphetamine lab seizures in the country last year, behind only Missouri, Tennessee, Indiana and Kentucky.

This hour on Focus, host Jim Meadows talks with recovering meth addict Michael Pasley about his ordeal with the drug. He says using meth was just a way of life, but looking back on it, he has a lot of regrets. Professor Ralph Weisheit, who is an expert on rural crime and meth, also joins us. He says efforts to curb meth use by instituting restrictions on buying pseudoephedrine have changed the way people manufacture meth, and if use continues to rise, he predicts we’ll see a parallel rise in crime in rural parts of the state.


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    Pop Up Archive Item: “Meth Use On the Rise Again in Illinois” :
    Transcript for file: focus131023a.mp3


    5 years ago
    arrests in Illinois connected to methamphetamines were as Lois it ever been
    this year silverdaddies expected number of arrests in Statesville double time out
    nationally meth usage down but its on the rise in East Central
    central Illinois state’s rate of meth lab seizures is among the highest in the country


    post about something about meth from TV shows like breaking bad
    what a day on focus will find out a little bit more from my colposcopy
    recovering meth addict Coles County criminologist round one shot
    Illinois State University Angie Meadows pizza Spokane WA

    program continues after the news welcome to
    welcome to focus on Jim Meadows methanphetamine is the illicit drug


    that uses of other related drugs look down on and laws in Illinois make it harder to gether
    ingredients needed to make it never the less law enforcement officials reporting
    increase in meth lab seizures and arrests in the state in east central
    central Illinois the most arrests by 4 have occurred in Vermilion County today on Fox
    focus we going to find out more about meth trafficking in Illinois from a criminologist
    just use me to study of Miss trafficking and from a former meth user
    ologist is Ralph oneshot distinguished professor of criminal justice at Illinois State


    State University of normal and the professor Weisheit welcome to focus thank you
    and join me on the phone is Michael Passley of Mattoon he’s a recovering meth addict
    who’s not working on putting his life back together Michael welcome to focus
    Michael R Us okay thanks
    thank you for being on the program today you’re welcome Michael can you
    you tell me about when you started using drugs
    Maya early like teen years what what drugs were


    drugs what drugs did you start with a alcohol in a pot
    early early teen years old how old are you now 35 when
    when was the first time you first use math uh route 20
    what why did you go from the other drugs for using over to Mass
    I was more readily available cheaper K
    what did you like about it how to make you feel the speed
    um I was able to do more things I was the it longer Cox Mohr


    more things that was doing time okay um have you heard anything
    any bad things about it before you before you tried it
    know when your in when you’re an addiction you really hear bad things about
    about drugs affect people get in trouble for smoking a hookah
    what is how did how did you first of a cross it mean to induce de Tulear
    I had some uh uh
    okay well if any of this is for miliarty you if you are someone close to you


    experience with message we would like to hear from you doing this program you can call him
    calling with your questions and comments at 1 800 22 29455
    i5 phone number again toll free 1 800 222 wyll
    you can also email acid will dash talking Illinois .edu
    walking your questions on Facebook and Twitter at focus 580
    um I was wondering how did your how did your you
    how to use evolve did you is there such a thing is going from light to heavy use of this stuff


    yeah it started out as a socially uh Party internet
    became you no longer and Sedition came or base by the
    was it you know used for friends and people you knew who gave it
    give it to you for your bonnet um at first I was buying it
    that I got introduced on how to how to make it so I don’t have to buy Danny Moore ok
    how complicated is is is making meth not at all
    not complicated at all and um I don’t know we want to go


    was there a difficulty I know there been lositive comin trying to restrict
    the sum of the ingredients was was it difficult of the find the ingredients to add to make it
    make it at first it was it was a everything was really available
    um and then over the years they put in laws against uh
    the buying of the dust settles ok and sew
    essentially you can’t go when you buy a whole bunch of sudafed pills anymore not anymore
    can’t no sir so so so did you find a way to get around that


    years after yesterday are ways around it ok um
    how are you in just in the drug at first startup
    snorting and smoking it and then after your address to became F
    sleep I’m sorry but we’re getting a little break up on your cell phone
    snorting and smoking and then you moved on to another way yeah interveniously
    intravenously and it was was that just because it was it was was it faster with it
    what’s the temperature cyst


    text that I had moved up and how to do it
    ok does is is this a center drug worthy em whereas
    as you use it more often you need a little more of it to get the same set of impact
    yes after certain time period of staying at multiple days at a time yes you have to
    I have to do you have to do more to get the same effect okay now
    Michael you understand you were not using meth all the time it first aid youjizz
    you’re just really Justice certain times when you have a lot of free time


    yeah I was up when I was working out I work construction I work today from 9 to 10 months
    what year and I wasn’t able to two of maintain that addiction
    but when I would get laid off in the winter time it was a hundred miles an hour just about anywhere with you
    take me to was so you could you could move in and out
    can i from times when you did not feel the need the time so you definitely did I just
    just had to have some sort of stuff control if I if that’s
    that’s if that’s possible times where did trickle over into my pears


    ok was there a moment when you knew you were addicted menu
    good actually said yourself I’m addicted to methamphetamine yeah April 5th
    2010 why was the manufacturing methamphetamine I knew that I had a problem when you were
    you are arrested you say yes okay an even before then YouTube
    you you you you you would not have describe yourself as a meth addict
    no not really Santa Claus many problems
    just the nature of addiction okay you filled your your your phone


    felt that you were coping you were you were you in your working when you need when you were able to work
    working at SoDo saying yes okay I want to I want to pull over and talk
    talk to Professor WI shot for a moment and um is is
    is a is is Michaela a typical consumer and in terms of people use meth
    Smith does is a pattern to recognize its not unusual pattern doll
    does an image in the public’s mind I think that someone tries meth once
    once and immediately they spin out of control and that’s not usually how it works usually people


    people build up to it NFL does the problem level Commons
    common for a lot of drugs are addictive drugs and meth is a little different than
    and some other drugs in that it is a stimulant and so I can actually be helpful if you
    if you have a lot of things to do you have a more things when you have time
    time for metal give you energy and it has a practical application bad
    that is very seductive for people Michael did you have a feeling
    good feeling of times do you felt you were functioning better with with the message use


    yeah for a million 24 hours in a day
    today normal person needs to have 8 hours of sleep but when you’re under the influence of meth in fed
    feels like that there are times there a hundred dollars in a day there’s nothing to eat
    that you can get done and get it cost okay now you started cooking meth and you learned it from
    did from other other people around this far as I guess the community of people who used
    used in Coles County what what’s a group was that
    um actually I didn’t learn how to cook it in the end the in this area to another area


    um a question well I’m just
    I’m just wondering you can you can you can watch a lot of movies and TV shows about drug addiction
    and um it can be if it can be pretty scary did you feel you were a month
    scary people when you were when you were learning about cooking meth
    the people that I had been raised with my whole life they weren’t scary
    movies with people you grew up with went to school with yes and
    but but but all of you well I guess not every single one of you work


    the word work but your grown up butter butter butter fly to you have come across this truck
    yes okay how to wake people it is not this earth
    things that you can look up an encyclopedia where people learn tips on a non doing this
    doing this thing is specially is the laws made it tougher unspoken
    Spoken recipes in her hand down over generations of time there’s thousand ways to make the
    make the drug now we we we hear about things about the dangers of
    is off of making mass of meth lab explosions in and risks when you when you


    when you do the same thing did did you talk with with other folks we’re cooking meth about
    about what to do what not to do did you take certain precautions there are
    are there yesterday dangers with the with making this up with this stuff
    this stuff and there are some do’s and don’ts and some of cardinal rules you are absolutely
    absolutely not allowed to a to engage in to make yourself
    self safe and uh we all pretty much knew that if this happened this is what you doing
    you know um fire need oxygen


    oxygen there will be no fire okay so you know the least
    these were your friends justice twists was essentially your community friends and family at the time you
    signs you were using meth and you say that since 2010 when you are arrested
    Arrested you for you for you have to walk away from all that
    what’s a difficult know I was the most physically mentally just
    just drained and I was willing and able to do anything that I possibly have to do to get out of that
    lifestyle ok and a bike bike that point


    you were ready I’m wondering um you say I wasn’t real
    really until you were arrested that you felt you needed to make a change
    yeah I was the charge with a 2 super class X felony is into class 216
    term a pretty much know that I had a problem when I was sitting in jail
    mi bon was is high is it was and the charges that that word
    heard that I would probably spend the rest of my life behind bars okay you win
    who went through I take it the the drug court system for on currently in


    lien road in the Coles County Drug Court program yes okay I 10 and how does that work
    work what does that work for you and your case um it is the
    is okay there are some ups and downs to it um its ever
    structured and it is a very fellowship oriented
    there’s some people in drug court we are family
    help each other when I were falling behind and uh just live
    live sober living and the try to get past a car


    are demons and I move on to a better life for this is focus on Jim Meadows Way
    does were talking today about meth usage in Illinois with Michael pass away is recovering
    covering meth addict in Coles County also with criminologist round fly side of Illinois
    State University of Michael if you can hold on the phone I just wanted to ask if you
    if you questions for Professor one side um we’re seeing report
    reports here and we have a and we have sores on our Aaron dumb
    and um land on our website about uh


    in increase in Indian Masteron mass production certainly methlabs
    Caesars in arrests in this area is that something that you been seeing over the past
    the past few years this kind of things can 11 flow but one
    one of the things very different is that you’re seeing a growing number
    number of labs a really small abscess cold one pot method where is made in
    made in a 2 liter bottle or less and so the disc
    the scale of the slabs is binge drinking because it’s been harder to get the


    better pills are needed to spin harder to get them high dress with these small
    no one pot method you can make a small batch of meth with
    fewer pills you don’t need to get in high dress you can buy cold packs from
    Pharmacy um affect its serve at a strange thing
    changeling for many people did CVS has announced that you will not have
    not have to show an ID to buy nail polish remover and you might wonder why in the world
    the world with nail polish remover be something for what you need an ID will the solvent


    and in the old days with larger labs would you something like Almond fuel
    but with these little small labs they can use against dollar amount taken
    take the contents of cold packs instead of getting in Hydra simonia they can use milk
    nail polish remover instead of buying gallons of Coleman fuel so um
    is it what if we see numbers going up right now
    are these is the really more eddies and eddies in currents within a larger pan
    your pattern Razr or is there some change happening now in Matthews


    use this region unfortunately that’s one of those things were only time will tell you its
    hindsight is always great with the sorts of things umm I’ll be there is a concern
    no one of the things its worth noting here is it we tend to
    to f*** is on meth because of the seizure of labs at bat assumes that
    is it meth hasn’t been around isn’t a drug or was I think one of the real
    real concerns long term will be if we successfully squash
    meth production domestically locally you’re going to see an increase in math distributive


    Fusion from Mexican drug cartels and then you’re going to see
    the violence and crime associated with the business of drugs
    because usually you don’t see a lot of crime with the small labs you don’t feel like there’s no 5
    fighting over turf frequently the guy that the labs are producing
    who sing this message without a lot of cash Trading hands people barter
    and so that the level of violence is relatively low end with the exception of
    captain of domestic violence ok Michael I wonder if I could ask you in your


    in your experience in of course I know your experience and didn’t 2010
    um what is there medicine in your community coming in from outside of was it
    what is it to essentially product to people cooked up on their own ia
    I don’t does becoming for many out side uh uh
    influences I’m sure there probably was but it is full of people that I was in a band
    what worried about other places
    why I am sure that the probably was was there was was


    was there a lot of organized dealing of mass of words it or was it a level
    Levolor everybody was pretty much making their own stuff um I didn’t really
    really know of too many not from here I just gotta move
    mugeres got dropped in dropping the Aryan started doing my own thing and the after
    after a shower after about 10 months of doing it on my own I was a state
    stepped on that I was arrested okay so um
    Brown from wandering event that that sounds like something along


    off of the old pad you seen off of meth manufacturing usage distribution
    people are pretty much making it on on their own and not the sort of working
    organize dealing were the conflicts at Lido the violence yeah I’m not sick
    Justin that bad organize the dealings having some connections to Mexico
    Mexican cartels Justin thats here now voice not not an Illinois Central
    central Illinois Justin however the the extent were able to squash
    watch these small labs we have to be concerned about the the transition


    fish into that kind of the market and remember that just because you get rid of flab
    flabs doesn’t mean you get rid of people’s desire for the drug okay you win
    you were telling me a little bit about the history of methamphetamine about how its it actually
    started like c** a lot of drugs that are not you legally considered very dangerous
    as an over the counter medication absolutely it started as a teenager
    nasal decongestant people abort nasal inhalers and used it for
    for as my mother in hay fever no other kinds of the breathing conditions


    and even now it’s a sin to eat a controlled substance but it does still have
    still have a legitimate or lease to form of methamphetamine has a legitimate pharmaceutical
    use a lot of people don’t realize that they assume that messes
    is instantly addictive that it’s dangerous and cannot be used safely
    the reality is the methamphetamine is was called the schedule 2 drug
    which means a doctors can prescribe it and they do and their three condition
    ambitions for which you can be prescribed at one of them is narcolepsy


    what’s the word people fall asleep intersection mother driving down the road
    a very dangerous condition and methamphetamine help you stay awake
    another condition is extreme obesity I’m talking about obesity to the point
    point that your health is in danger and finally we can give methamphetamine to children
    14 attention deficit disorder not the first drug test turn to that typically
    epicly Dexedrine and then followed by ritalin but there are some
    some cases where children are given math for attention deficit


    and those cases its is true that you don’t see a lot of problems emerge
    because the doses are controlled unlimited okay um and soul
    and so the dosage that you that you that you have in legal Matthews
    how does it compare to weather to what does someone is taking Madera
    cooking up their own the problem with people who use recreationally is there
    there’s nothing to stop them from increasing the dos and the thing about metal
    methamphetamine that makes it different from a lot of other drugs but it similar to


    where to stimulants like cocaine is it methamphetamine make you feel really good
    and you don’t want to stop feeling really good but the thing about math
    what math is the higher you get in terms of your feeling the better you feel when your using it
    using it the worse you feel when it wears off and you know when you feel bad
    the best way to feel good again is to use more map Michael was was that
    that’s your experience the difference between how you felt when you were using mass and how you
    how you felt in between times ia a done


    cocaine in the past is well and down off of it cheating but the comedown
    down off of meth amphetamine is completely different just for myself
    I would stay up 78 Oscar and when I got tired
    tired of being up for whatever I can pull myself off of it I sleep for
    45 days get up and start all over again now if your if you’re up for 7 or 8
    aretes that means you’re you’re taking continue doses of meth
    depends on how I was doing if I was snorting adderall was smoking it you know yet


    yes um continuous use but when I got into the interveniously part of it I would
    why would I usually take 304 healthy shots today and to get myself
    today was that something you disgust with you know with other friends and people
    people you knew you were using meth without a appointed discussion what’s up what’s the proper DOS
    where does so what’s up what’s up what’s a safe dose no just do it you know it
    don’t sit down and have a discussion
    just use it ok and and and round that she was saying


    saying does it mean if if if if if you’re not paying close attention bulldog
    will dosage is 10 to go up over time sure because of what call tolerance where it takes
    it takes more to get the same effect and mad at me
    everyone escalates are people who are able to use in a controlled way
    the problem is we don’t know in advance to those people are we don’t know who does people are who
    are who we lose control ok is methanol timidly a toxic drug
    Middle East in the way its used are do people die every directly are there


    are there there’s just side effects ed that uh just General
    the great Hills dying from meth is unusual unlike
    heroin with slow the body down to the poor alcohol is close to body down to the point that a check
    shutdown methamphetamine speeds body up in the biggest risk
    of harm is heart attack or heat stroke or suicide
    suicide in and suicide would follow coming down when you’re feeling this depression
    Michael when you were using did you notice any


    of physical health affects from method did you only notice
    note is the the good feeling um I never really noticed any effect
    sex while I was using b*** after after I did get cleaned out I didn’t know
    did notice some long term effects that I was notable OK
    gay c** just one and what what what sort of long term
    term effects have you seen my sleeping disorders were
    we’re not normal my eating schedules were not normal of my thigh


    my thought in my thoughts and actions words or normal
    hide a developed the
    paranoia after the fact you know I thought
    everybody to get me in the head just
    what is it normal like I could have been ran over in
    chaton over again
    186 told your joints your muscles and I


    why was I in Pretty Fortunato 35 years old all of my teeth
    my teeth are some people over the years that they have what they called meth mouth
    33 rotten I am pretty SportsNet that I uh I didn’t
    the sleeping disorders Demi do you have
    you have trouble sleeping through the night now are ours I don’t sleep all the way through
    through if I get up of what you want to say
    say exile and sometimes I won’t go to sleep till


    1112 2 o’clock in the morning other times when I get really tired
    tired at 830 tonight depending on a pretty much have to wear myself down throughout the
    today in order to go to our way just seems like I’m just running
    100 hour my whole life and my body’s use to just wear it
    black working through out the day I noticed if you know now that I’m not working
    working gear in the last 3 weeks am i sleeping patterns RNA are not normal
    okay I was thinking back to what you would say about being up for a 44


    for rent in 7 days straight under the under the influence is that the long
    the longest you have been up to Ginny Weasley know the longest ride ever been up to
    22 days what is that like
    Metta World lots of lucid nations paranoid
    umm you don’t associate yourself in public
    use to clean yourself elation
    okay now I’m I’m just I’m just a little curious year because your


    does your telling me that certainly um this this truck feels good witch’s WI
    you were taking it for the time that you did but those server facts of being up
    being up continuously don’t sound exactly Plaza um well
    well now that I look back on it and it doesn’t seem Pleasant b***
    b*** and through my addiction a that was what I wanted to do
    throw the earth rap years I’ve messed with HughesNet Gen X
    and I like speed so when you stay up a number matter day is on methamphetamine


    it’s like a two for one you know you get to hallucinate your speeding
    and that was just something that I enjoyed okay well we’re going to take a shower
    take a short break here and we will be back in a moment with more about a message
    Edmunds in central Illinois Hiiraan focus on wyll
    Rebecca focus in WY LMG Meadows my guess
    guests are Michael Passley he is a former meth user living in Mattoon
    toon he has not been using mats for about 3 years now professor Ralph washer


    is a criminologist at Illinois State University is made of study of meth
    message trafficking if methamphetamine users disrupted your family or is he just have
    questions for our guest please call us at 1 800 to 2294
    455 email us at will dash talk at
    you were on Twitter and Facebook at focus 5801 the phone number again
    1 800 222 WILL
    I was wondering time does Asda to the degree


    the greens at you can say this about the drug use does does methamphetamine have a Democrat
    graphic is there a demographic profile of the typical meth user are
    where are the are the demographics of the center of population with meth users are found
    found most likely well in the Midwest is the primary
    primarily white it is primarily rural you don’t see math is a street drug in
    Chicago not yet at some point you likely will but you don’t see it yet it is
    what is a drug generally that um more men than women use it


    use it but the percent of meth users for women is higher than the percent
    sent off other drug users who are women so it has an appeal to women
    um more so than appears to be true for any other drugs
    okay um any other particular in a subculture Zeds Dead
    what were meth users found well the old days I used to talk about biker gang
    all that bit people really talk about that much anymore um I don’t think you can
    you can really talk about that after being subcultures in the Midwest lease


    least beyond what I just described if you go out to the West it’s an enormous
    problem in the Native American tribes is enormous problem with these
    the Spanish population in the Midwest ear tends to primarily be white
    rural hum not necessarily
    Lioele of communities but its not a condition related to poverty
    okay I had red things about meth use and I just don’t know if there’s anything above
    above other levels for incense in gay club culture or something like that is that


    is that an area where a Mathews is found more than other places
    what Lee if you look at the way method is used in the country you don’t find me
    find meth is a street drug in New York City you don’t find it in Chicago is a street drug
    drug police not yet and if you talk to police Adele say no we don’t really
    don’t really have meth but methods actually rather popular as a party drug in the gay community
    gay community in gay clubs but the people go to gay clubs on top doing good
    doing drug dealing on the street or not out getting arrested and so there under the radar


    radar for the police about we know for for my interviews with a narcotic
    products of Ceres in Nashville go in New York in Washington DC in
    in Boston that Mexican cartels who supplied to cook
    the cocaine in the cities have been trying to get their they’re distributors tube
    is to distribute methamphetamine I so far without much luck so I suspect you see it
    will see you in the cities in in the Midwest eventually you do in the West Coast Plaza
    what I think you will eventually seating cities in Illinois for example


    the thing that they’re trying to introduce it but they haven’t had much success um
    feeling of Leon nakedly capitalistic here come the computer on price window
    when does a drug like this is home made in somebody Kansas well
    is not homemade so much in the largest cities in part because the odor
    is there goes on with cooking makes it a and natural drug to produce in rural areas were
    is where the smell can drift away before its to take to buy others
    I fink for Mexican traffickers the appeal is that they can control the entire production process


    process unlike cocaine where they are dependent on South America to supply the cookie
    the cocaine and they simply moving through with methamphetamine a control everything
    so there’s really as as a business there’s a real economic incentive for the
    for the Mexican traffickers to move to math and away from cocaine
    you know im in this is a question of let me ask you first Michael out if there’s one
    does one pop culture a picture of methamphetamine use out there Delilah
    a lot of people know about I was thinking would be the TV show Breaking Bad


    is that have you seen that show and is it anything like
    like the experiences that you knew what the people you knew when you were using meth
    um not not really maybe the Early Show
    show I’ve seen in a couple episodes I did see the first when I did see the last
    last episode what is FRS you know wat is like that
    like that around here I don’t believe so that was when did the TV
    TV show was that use more of a there was more big time meth production in traffic


    trafficking in that show them what you are experiencing TV show
    Ann Dowd Ralph the same thing you know is it
    did the shows like this are they in any way a picture of you know an accurate picture of Matthew cinema
    America in America as a whole know but you know the show is cited
    cited in New Mexico on the border and off
    some of the things in there the chemistry is is basically right
    what’s wrong about the show is the level of violence within the


    in the US connected to the business there a level of violence depicted in the show
    who is actually really pretty accurate if you were a cross the border in Mexico
    but the violence in the show is is pretty much exactly a rated R one to get across
    across the border into the US but a lot of the elements of the show
    show your pretty accurate for that part of the country for that part of the country Mike
    Michael I was 18 can you tell me about your experiences after your
    do your breast and what it was like getting off of meth


    um I like I said I was arrested I said in jail for
    oenotri months and I’m coming down was the mayor of motion roller coaster
    coaster um I was granted the the option of
    when is going to treatment and getting clean and to start a new life
    after I got a treatment um if I really wasn’t as difficult
    cold as ice anticipated to us to get clean and sober I like I said
    said I was more than willing and and and and ready to do anything today it’s just me


    okay you know I was wondering you know I hear about when somebody else
    how to get off say hello in there things like methadone um is there anything like
    think like that Indian in the Indian in the process of getting off of meth
    um I was the I was in custody so uh
    my drying out was the much force upon me you know I
    I wasn’t able to run out and go cook a batch dope because I was
    I was coming down I was I was in a secure environment and the pretty much


    whats the fastest way from everything that’s what I needed at that time you know
    how long did how long did it take for you for your your your body
    body to shake of the of the sake of the craving
    the craving was pretty much gone when I got arrested but the
    after affects you know quite some time I buy red study 1
    31 times at the day after effects of meth last up to 2 years
    there was some things that did that I didn’t curve that were the world long lasting


    like I said my sleeping my eating and the sum of my normal
    thought process well its its been 3 years now if it up
    can can can you can you tell the difference between them
    maybe the first year were to definitely
    my life is the more manageable its not its not a world
    whirlwind its not kaotic I have a structure
    structured living that I do and I it’s just a


    you know I know that when I go to bed of a more of a night you know I’m going to get up
    how to get up the next morning if I do the same thing is a prior there’s a really good chance I’m not going
    not going to get up and make mass dumass drink or do any sort of a
    kind of drugs you went into a treatment program after your
    you know after you after your body detox to sew to speak what was the Treaty
    is the treatment program about in what’s the things that you doing that
    Hedley structured I had to get up early in the morning and do


    meditation chores set down in a day
    dining area at a table with other addicts
    I was in a residential treatment for number of days
    and I was rude successfully discharge from there and then I move to a 3
    three quarter house and was a little bit more leeway 2
    degrade myself back into a community get a job
    try to just get back on track so you’re working now


    yes I am okay are you doing the same center construction work you were before
    or or something different no of being in the drug court program
    Coles County IL I’m kind of limited on the kind of work that I do
    I was the vault in the labors Union before and
    pretty much travel all over the place and now being involved with the drug court program
    where am I not able to travel to buy 8:30 in the morning I have to call in
    call and see if my color is is drawn to where I have to go drop off


    periodically through the week there are there are groups that I am
    entitled to go to there are meeting st I’m entitled to go to uh right now
    right now I have to appear once once a week at the drug court
    drug court on Thursdays requirement of drug court
    so its it’s pretty much truck shirts and that and that is good because of
    because of you know running 100 miles an hour for many years I did I didn’t have any structure what’s
    whatsoever so ungrateful to be a um um


    involved in drug court program it is definitely save my life and I as allowed
    how to turn my life around to live like a normal human being rather than some
    drug addicted freak so you’re not able to do the work you were doing
    where do in what what sort of work are you doing now I’m a mechanic for
    for an outfit the Charleston okay so to set a job that keeps you
    you don’t have to travel for no sir I’m I’m with in about a 2000
    minutes from walking for my front door to a friend or where I work at


    I am struck by the by the by there by the contrast because
    because it sounds like what u what was the sighting about using meth
    what was that rush and just dumb
    just all these things happening all that once now it’s what you what you
    what you what you what your bracing is is routine in something that Prince when you were you
    using meth you would have just what is considered a terrible way to live yes
    yes I’m in my early recovery I made myself a promise to 5


    if I put as much work and involvement as I did too runny
    running a hundred miles an hour as I say not as I do with it to my recovery and put that much
    that much work into it that I should be ok if its it’s a sin
    the daily if its a lot of work and you know it
    when I got clean and sober that you know everything was going to be butterflies and you know it
    sunrises and sunsets you know what is in some aspect don’t have me
    near the chaotic crap going on in my life but I do have problems going on


    my life now but I’m able to come I’m able to Maine
    maintain it without having to run in the use drugs and alcohol now
    NOK you have to walk away from a whole group of friends and associates
    Super using math who you hang around with now
    everyone thats in recovery um I don’t hang around with those type of people anymore
    as you know when when you’re involved with that kind of world do you know you think you have
    you have friends you know but when when you get in trouble you find out who your friends really are really the only


    only friends that that that start with P where my family
    the way for many years I have a health dept
    program my family is the ocean
    around now you know I don’t have any desire to hang around people the more you know
    are doing what I’m doing and they and I’m not doing the 30 really have a kid
    okay we’re getting just a little bit of telephone break up I don’t know if you have
    if you have any control over that up there but I do want to remind listeners we are talking about


    issues involving of methamphetamine use we are talking with a former user
    user Michael up Michael Passman of a map to excuse me Michael Penn
    Michael Passley of Mattoon and also talking with a criminologist at Illinois State University
    city of normal Ralph a one shot who has made a study of a
    official surrounding message trafficking and use still time to get your questions
    Shannon into our guest the phone number 1 800 222 945
    55 inch 1 800 222 WILL are you can eat


    email us at will a dash talk and then some will dance
    sex talk at phone number again 1 800 22
    222 a wi ll we do have a cold and now online
    line 4 of Peter from Chicago Aniston have a question for professor
    yes actually for both your cats
    ok I like the first congratulate your guts to hang Strawn
    recovery epicly since I’m from a generation that knows all to him


    internet weigh on a truck Houston of you spell question I have essential
    that’s what you get steel about um a beta particle
    legalization of drugs in the mall so I thought
    what does the professor in particular should be the proper
    proper criminal justice approach
    okay um Peter thank you very much and I’ll tell me Ralph
    how you know a specially or especially at a time win loss about marijuana


    changing a very different drum for methamphetamines but what do you think is a criminologist
    logist is the best approach a torch could a toy Smith and fat
    another drugs I wish I had a great answer to that um
    it’s in my mind clearly a drug for which legalization just doesn’t make any sense
    seance on the other hand is not clear that really brutal hearts punishment
    make a lot of sense I do think things like the drug court are extreme
    extremely you spell extremely valuable I do think there’s a difference between using


    using meth and making meth I think of the manufacture meth is a dangerous active
    activity and there should be a should be in is a different level of punishment for that
    um but I don’t think legalization really makes any sense
    for most of these drugs in and I will say I do see marijuana
    as an exception of early for medical use and I think it’s important
    import into separate marijuana from the other drugs for medical use at least
    Michael you’re someone whos really been to the system on this looking at it


    looking at now as a former user 018 what are your feelings to a house
    how to side should approach math um
    believe that they should probably help out people that are good
    do they have the right pro Shana
    minimize or exclude the buying and selling of a the
    the hills but like I said before there a thousand thousand waves making meth


    lighting it is absolutely absurd and uh it’s something doesn’t
    okay it sounds like drug court was was was really a god
    send for you um how many meth users get it
    get to the point where the ready to do the work that essentially drug court require something
    um that’s that’s hard to say because I eat in visual is different you know you
    pretty much have to get to point word you’re done you know and you know for me to say when
    say when that person is Donner when a person says they’re done it all goes by action you know actions speak


    speak louder than words you know I mean I’ve been up I’ve been able to stay away from
    drug you know its a daily the daily reprieve in others think that I have to do
    do to maintain my sobriety you know um and I said I’m very truly grateful
    grateful for the word has 80 turn the lights out
    I believe that I believe that there are other account
    should I do it you know it gives up give us a addicts another
    another a chance to live inside you rather than just walk away in prison for


    for people to Twitter the recipes I hang around with other
    cooks and I figure out what they did wrong so you get out of a kid
    difference where they don’t get caught smoking and we have an email in from Dane anime
    and I’m wondering around my side effects if 15 is is is
    is pointing to questions about the criminalizing marijuana
    send message to produce one person is figured out how to make it potentially listing
    less dangerous drugs were more accessible would people turn to meth less often


    is there any way to answer that question that is no way to answer that question but I suspect
    fact that it would make that much difference quite frankly okay there’s a fire
    is a follow up question from dainty have any thoughts on the connection between off of
    the war on if I think there’s a type of here but I think you meant to write the war on
    war on drugs and the rise of myth um did people
    people for Brampton people trying to Matthews because of
    because other drugs become more difficult to obtain


    the question I can’t directly answer but I can say this that if you look package store glee
    we tend as it as a society to go to cycles of steam
    stimulant drugs followed by narcotics using rise now of heroin use
    who’s that was something that was very predictable people shift from one form
    form of from one type of stimulation to another and heroin use is likely to
    Glee to continue to be an issue to increase and over a period of the decade
    will switch back to increasing use a stimulant it’s a pattern is happy


    is happened over and over so if you’re going to Herriman now they may be going more at some point in time
    time to stimulants such as methamphetamine buy some point in time I’m referring probably today
    Decatur two decades but its in the long-term trends or go back and forth between
    between these and it makes something sweet and have a short memory we forget about all the
    all the problems the drug created that was used 20 years ago
    in different states have different laws odds trying to block
    send fed min I think it’s Mississippi in Oregon which is made of peoples Federal containing drugs


    drugs prescription drugs um here in Illinois
    the limit how much does a federal you can buy a time um do all these have work
    workaround for a dedicated the future um the the limit
    the limit on how much you can buy certainly have workarounds the prescription is harder to work around
    around but I would point out that for many people who abuse drugs
    the use the drug that is available and so if you take away methamphetamine
    mean it doesn’t mean you stop drug abuse it means that individuals likely to shift


    1500 drug in in the challenge always is to figure out a way to
    minimize harm from drugs I will I get to the minute we have
    we have left my Michael I want to turn back to you and it sounds like you’ve you’ve made
    who made a lot of progress in your life is just in the last few years being off of methamphetamine
    what are your plans what are your hopes for the future
    they don’t how to make too many goals because
    asceticism daytoday you know but like I said to you know if I was long


    long as I do what I did yesterday BBT
    is well of another thing to know if its an epidemic just like in
    the early 90’s it was crack cocaine out now
    now its not as big as it was before you know and now it now heroin an hour
    LLL Christmas really hard it’s really hard to predict what will be the next drug
    you know uh I just I just know that umm
    hi I’m very grateful for being loud is chance to two terms


    turn my life around ijust a state
    Stateline sober and live this life I know what the life let me know
    lot of trouble whats prison time of this is an epiphany and I’m not sure
    not sure we’re leaving streaks at work where I can go with it
    what my capacity of a certainly the best of the best of luck to you now in the future
    future Michael Passley is in Mattoon
    who is a former user of math and Men accent


    accent on the former there and Ralph what size is a criminologist a professor at
    Illinois State University in normal and I want to thank you for being on the program
    gram today and there’s more reporting on the subject from a Cu citizen X
    is an access on our website at this video store reproduce by sea
    BICU citizen access Illinois public media which will a remote WY
    TV during PBS Newshour weekend Saturday and Sunday at 5 p.m.
    pm today show produced by Lindsey moon Jason Crawford Technical Director salary laskari


    NASCAR intern and special things to see you citizen access for their reporting on this issue
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