Episode 86: Visiting with Luisa Gomez of Bloomington-Normal and her story, “I Call BS”

                                    SSPP ep. 86 LUISA GOMEZ

Luis Gomez of Bloomington-Normal joins Kerry and Jenette this week on the podcast to share their personal experiences with grief and trauma, highlighting the power of storytelling and the need for vulnerability and authenticity. A tragic, sudden shift during the rehearsal process caused Luisa to focus on their struggles with loss and mental health, emphasizing the importance of self-care, therapy, and community support.




ANNOUNCER  00:00  Raising women's voices one story at a time. Welcome to The She Said Project Podcast.
 [Music: The She Said Project Podcast Theme]

###
JENETTE JURCZYK  00:27  It's a live one here today on The She Said Project Podcast. I am so excited to be here in the studio. I'm Jenette, your host National Director of That's What She Said,The She Said Project here in Champaign Urbana, Illinois with my friend, my beautiful friend, and co-host Kerry Rossow.
 
KERRY ROSSOW  00:44  Hi, Jenette Jurczyk.
 
JENETTE  00:45  Hi, Kerry
 
KERRY  00:46  It's so good to see you. And you all can't see it. But I gotta tell you, your hair is on point today. You always have a strong hair game, but everyone should just be able to know... this is just fabulous!
 
JENETTE  00:57  Because my hair is 90% of my personality? (laughing) Seriously, if you know me, I have to give credit. I came from the salon today, so...
 
KERRY  01:05  Live it like you got it.
 
JENETTE  01:07  This is not like I woke up like this, today was here today, which is, you know, only every few months. So you caught you me on a good one. Too bad our friends are just listening today and they can't get all this gloriousness they're gonna have to trust my voice and not my hair.
 
KERRY  01:20  Well, I will soak it all up. I might have to come over there and brush it.
 
JENETTE  01:24  Oh, dear. So we have a treat for our listeners today. We get to chat with one of the incredible women who appeared on stage and That's What She Said, like we do. Our friend today appeared in the Bloomington-Normal show recently in the fall of 2023. And let me tell you a little bit about Luisa Gomez. I met Luisa -- she was actually volunteering at one of our That's What Teens Say weekends in Peoria. Yeah.
 
KERRY  01:25  Well, goodness. What?
 
JENETTE  01:29  Well, she and I worked one of the Teen weekends when we launched in Peoria. And we met it was complete fate. I'm telling you. And you know, when you meet someone, Kerry, and you're like, this woman, I gotta put her in a show.
 
KERRY  02:01  Yep. They don't know what hit 'em.
 
JENETTE  02:03  That is what happened. When I met Luisa. It was like fireworks going off. And she had no idea. But I did ask her and she joined the cast. And some interesting things happened during her time leading up to the show. And it was a bit of a challenging journey for her. So we're going to bring her on the call. And her story turned out... you're looking at me like oh my goodness, but her story turned out on point. But it took a little bit to get there. And so we're gonna bring Luisa on here to tell our listeners a little bit about her journey. So Luisa, how are you? Welcome to the podcast.
 
LUISA GOMEZ  02:34  Oh, thank you. Thank you. I am doing well today. I'm so excited to be on the podcast today. I can tell you when I got the invitation, I was like, sign me up, please!
 
JENETTE  02:45  Oh, wonderful to hear your voice. And meet my friend Kerry Rossow. Kerry, Luisa, and let me tell you she is a nugget of goodness.
 
KERRY  02:53  Oh, well, I am so happy to meet you. I was not at that show. But I will say I've seen the video and let's just start with your outfit. (laughing) Hello. Wow, are you a person that like right away? You're like, Yep, I know what I'm wearing? Or were you still deciding the day of?
 
LUISA  03:10  Well, you know, actually, to be honest, I had a couple of choices that I had, you know, planned. But there's a little backstory to my outfit. So I recently joined a sorority, the wonderful women of Sigma Gamma Rho, founded in 1922 at Butler University, and our sorority colors are royal blue and gold
 
KERRY  03:30  Go Dogs!
 
LUISA  03:31  So it was fitting for me to go up there to represent my sisters, while also representing Sigma Gamma Rho. And so it was a story behind that choice of color. And really, you know, even the skirt that I was wearing, it had pearls on it and we call our founders our Seven Pearls. So it's all intertwined. But if you didn't know it was 'Oh, this is a killer outfit,' but it actually was intentional to represent a significant portion of my life.
 
KERRY  03:58  Oh, now I love it even more. That is awesome. Okay, so it sounds like there's a backstory here that leads up to the show.
 
JENETTE  04:05  So yes,
 
KERRY  04:05  Somebody spill it!
 
JENETTE  04:06  So when Luisa was asked during the show, she was very excited. You know, we early on we go through what our potential topics might be. And Luisa and I landed on a pretty beautiful story when she was a student. And you had a moment in time, Luisa and this wasn't your ultimate story, but where you realized your own power of being a black woman. Remember that story?
 
LUISA  04:26  Oh! Yes, yes, yes. Yes. The story that we decided on, Jennette and Kerry, is I was going to talk about how I went back to school full time at Illinois State University as an undergraduate student, and I made the dedication and the decision to just do those final two years to get my bachelor's degree. And in the midst of that I was able to join a class that was life changing for me, it was called Black Feminist Thought. (WGS 393) And in that class, we explored themes of feminism through practice, through theory. We explored Patricia Hill Collins, Audre Lorde, every powerful black woman that you could think about, we read their bodies of work. And in that I was able to not only participate in symposiums for two years where I was able to present some of my work. And then the second year to be able to sit on a panel with members of the Black Lives Matter founders, but I also was able to travel to Canada to present my research as to why it's important to have black feminist on predominantly white campuses. And I was able to present that at the American Sociological Association conference that was held in Montreal, Canada that year. So I could say that that, for me was pivotal. You know, I think back to growing up, and I've always been secure in being black, you know, but I didn't have that you know, that monolithic, you know, it's like, we all have different lives. And we all come up with different ways. And I'm an Afro Latina, my mother is black. And so she told me what it was to be a feminist through her actions, as she probably would never have called herself a feminist but through her actions, she did. And that's what I learned, especially about black women, is we will do it, we show up in feminine spaces and feminist qualities and practicing. We just don't know the word or the language, that scientific language that's attached to it. But we do it every day, that we wake up, and we exist in this world. And so having that opportunity, for me, I feel like was a catalyst that just helped me define my voice and my role in this world. It's really empower myself and really understand what that power is, as I walk through my intersection.
 
KERRY  04:32  Wow, that is amazing. That is amazing. So that alone, that would be an amazing story to tell, how did you pivot?
 
JENETTE  06:22  Why yes, would have been a perfect fit.
 
KERRY  06:27  Yeah, perfect.
 
JENETTE  06:28  While we had all these amazing conversations going? Yes, yes, yes. That's What She Said is the right platform for this. Tell us girl, tell us how you came to this conclusion, then some
 
KERRY  06:58  Life happens.
 
JENETTE  06:59  Life happens. So Luisa, tell us what happened during our journey with That's What She Said,
 
LUISA  07:04  Well, you know, like Jenette said, we had settled on a story we were building it out, and I was still confident. And I'll just be honest, because I don't believe in not being honest, I'll be transparent. In my head, I said, I'm not going to be the sad story, I'm not going to be the one that has people crying, I said, it's because again, a lot of that, you know, people, you know, the women bare their souls, they're, they're healed, they're talking about it, but it's very emotional. So in my head, I'm like, I'm not gonna do that. That's not gonna be me. No!
 
KERRY  07:04  Famous last words, Famous last words.
 
LUISA  07:34  Yes! And then my life changed. And what happened in my life was that my ex husband died unexpectedly, at 56 years old. And we share two children. And we also share four grandchildren. And so here I am, in this moment in time, trapped with this grief that I didn't 1) have worked for, 2) it was unexpected. And the reason why I call it unexpected grief, is because my mother, she transitioned in 2020. And while you know, you never want anyone to pass away or transition or die. She have been diagnosed with pancreatic cancer the year before. So you know, you just kind of know that when the phone calls become less and less, and there's not as much interaction, you kind of prepare yourself a little, it's still grief, and it's still heavy. But it's like, you kind of know, it's expected grief.
 
KERRY  08:30  Mm-hmm.
 
LUISA  08:30  This is something I had never dealt with before. It was an unexpected grief. And even though we have been divorced for almost 10 years, he was a significant portion of my life. We met when I was 17 years old. And he had been in my life all those years. I'm not gonna say how old I am now. (laughing reaction) But it caused me to actually just become paralyzed. I became paralyzed. And I didn't want to do the show. I didn't want to talk about it. I didn't know what to do. I was paralyzed in my grief. And that's what happened to me. And so that was the pivotal moment where I had to say, am I going to do this? What does this look like? And it was such a blessing to be working with Jenette because she was able to create that space for me. And there's one moment in time I can specifically think about was, you know, when you're grieving, you don't really want to be around people because you don't want them to, you know, feel your sadness feel your grief because we traditionally as a society, we don't do well with grief at all. We don't do well with grief at all. We grieve in private. We give ourselves a timetable on grief. It's all these different things. So just imagine me grieving that heart for a man who was no longer my husband and I am married now and I have another child, but it was a very harsh grief. And Jenette invited me to assess it and she said just come. You don't have to talk. You don't have do anything, just come and sit, and let us hold that space for you. And when I walked into that room, every single woman just held space for me. And at that time, I wasn't sure if I was going to keep going or not. But that moment, they held space for me. And that's the power of women. And I think we don't even recognize just how powerful we are, no matter what color we are, when we understand each other, we're really supporting each other, holding that space is so important. And her creating that space for me. I will never forget it.
 
KERRY  10:35  Wow.
 
JENETTE  10:36  Yeah, I remember vividly the phone call when she let me know what had happened. And obviously, that is something you have... your world stops. You have to process and take care of things. And we were right in the middle of rehearsals. And I knew she needed time. And I knew she needed space. And there was one or two rehearsals where you know, she was occupied. And then she called me and she said, I'm not sure if I can do this. And I said, just come, Luis, I'm right there with you. I can remember exactly where I was driving my car, having this exact conversation with you. So I remember when you walked into the room that night, and I could feel your energy, I could feel the heaviness. And you let me share just enough with the group so that we all understood where you were. And that was the whole point is come listen to other women's stories, come hear where they are in their process. If you want to talk, you talk. And if you don't want to talk, you don't talk but just know we care enough that you are present. And that moment, she said we're going to move forward. But my story isn't what I think it was going to be. And so that was the evolution of Luisa's story. So Luisa, with your permission, I think it's time to share the recording with our audience so that they can hear the final version of what you flushed out with us during the process and then we can come back and chat some more.
 
LUISA  11:52  Oh, that sounds great.
 
JENETTE  11:53  Okay, so friends, I know every person listening right now has experienced grief and if you haven't, you're gonna, so here is an opportunity for you to connect, listen and learn from a woman who has been there. Please enjoy this performance by Luisa Gomez onstage at That's What She Said Bloomington Normal 2023 with her story, "I Call Bullshit." (laugh) 

 ###
 
LUISA GOMEZ  12:17 “Your silence will not save you.” Audre Lorde, Sister Outsider: Essays and Speeches.
 
12:28  Grief is universal. I bet there's not one person in this audience who hasn't experienced grief. Grief is a shapeshifter, constantly bobbing and weaving like an MMA fighter or boxer. And the last time I checked, your girl is not a trained MMA fighter nor am I a boxer. Now don't get it twisted -- I have been known to throw all these hands back in the day. But I'm proud to say I am reformed. I am no longer that person. I can promise you that you won't get these hands but I cannot promise you that you won't get some choice words, not curse words, per se. But I will speak up, but for the most part, I let a lot go. That's how I maintain my Zen.
 
13:26  When it comes to grief, we all grieve. Loss is loss. Loss of a loved one. Loss of a job. Loss of a parent, even loss of a relationship. I could go on and on about all the losses we will experience over the course of our lives. But as an Afro Latina who navigates this world as a black woman, I have realized that it is a luxury to fully grieve. And I call bullshit.
 
14:06  I lost my mother to pancreatic cancer. February 2020. There isn't a day that goes by that I don't miss her.
 
14:15  This is an indefinite grief. No one prepares you to live in this world as a motherless child. For me, my mother was the color yellow. A soft yellow, a comforting yellow, a warm yellow, the yellow of the Sun after a storm. To this day I find myself wanting to call her to share my life, to share my joys, to share my frustrations, to share my sorrows.
 
14:55  'Hey Mom, guess what? I got the job,' or 'Hey Mom, you are not gonna believe what baby girl said today!' Or even 'Hey, Mom, guess what? I'm going to be in this amazing show where I get to tell my story!'
 
15:14  I want to talk to her so much about how my little girl is finding her voice and finding her place in this complex world. Or how so damn proud of my two eldest children who continue to teach me and want me to be a better mother every single day. I especially want to share the joy of my grandchildren. And just the thought of them, makes me want to smile. That grief never goes away. It just sits there. It can make me smile at a memory or bring me to my knees sobbing.
 
16:01  But now I have a new grief. The grief of losing my ex husband unexpectedly. To be honest, this is an oppressive grief, an unforeseen grief and really, an inconvenient grief. And this is where I call bullshit. This grief feels like midnight. An opaque purple, the color the stain of crimson, intense, no sun, no moon blackness. His death is a foreign grief, a complicated and uncomfortable grief. I had known that man since I was 17 years old. Even though we hadn't been married for 13 years, we were married for almost 20.
 
16:56  So yeah, my world was rocked. We had unfinished business. We still had plans. Our children, though they were adults still needed us. We were co parenting our grandchildren dammit.
 
17:12  And I'll never forget my son saying to me, 'Mom, we lost 25% of our family. Now there's only three of us.'
 
17:24  And that's a void that can't be filled. I had take a step back. And really evaluate this grief. This weight of infinite tears. I couldn't fix it. I couldn't do the void. I couldn't be 50% I was 25% of a whole. And yet in my feeble but honorable attempt to be 50% my own percentage was dwindling rapidly. Dwindling with each thought. Each phone call, each text, each moment or same, each argument, each memory. I needed help.
 
18:22  SOS Yeah, me. I need help. Me! My mental and physical health. We're almost at 0%. If I didn't get the intervention, and guidance I needed to show up for myself, my children, my husband, my grandchildren, and those whom I love, I can honestly say I wouldn't have made it. Wow, this sounds relatable to others. It felt damn near impossible for me. I could not financially or mentally afford this grief. I was given three days leave for the passing of my ex. While that sounds generous, it takes about five days to just wake up. But I took those days and like oxygen just to live no time to grieve. And I call bullshit. Off to work I go because that's what you have to do. Right? No work no pay. Right? That's how life is. If only I could be Scarlett O'Hara and get to think about it tomorrow. But the way my black life is set up? Nope. All of the emotions, everyone's emotions. I absorbed them and they took me to a dark place, the place that made me question my existence. Because I'm not 50%.
 
18:35  A dear sister, friend of my tribe, who's a therapist and mentor heard my silent pleas. And she reached out to me. I asked her about some recommendations for supplements for my mental health, she provided a list, and I'm right there on Amazon. And I placed an order. Those supplements cost me over $100 and I call bullshit.
 
20:36  Here I am putting together my own treatment plan. Because I don't have the luxury to grieve. For real -- me. I'm piecing together my healing process and I call bullshit.
 
20:53  But what can I do? I can be proactive. I call my doctor and set up an appointment for a wellness check. And II'm gonna  be good, right? No, not so much. So at my appointment, my doctor handed me those dreaded dry erase mental health cards, you know, the scoring system. As I handed him back my cards, I looked him in the eyes. And I said, 'This is not pretty.'
 
 21:22
He looked at me looked at him. He looked at me again. I look back at him again. And then he looks at my cards. And he says, 'Luisa, I have to ask you the questions.' I reply, 'I know.'
 
21:41  I also know that I don't have the luxury to take the break I so desperately needed. I list all the factors that keep that dark place at bay. I have a young daughter, I don't abuse drugs or alcohol. And no, I don't have access to firearms. Yes, that's the list. And those are the questions I had to answer.
 
22:09  But I could say he heard me. He saw me. And he offered some relief through medication. And for that I'm grateful. So maybe just a little less bullshit.
 
22:25  Next on my list, because I'm going through my treatment plan, is to secure a therapist. Do y'all know how hard it is to get a therapist to call you back? Right?
 
22:37  I call bullshit! Can a sista get on somebody's schedule? (laughing)
 
22:43  Again, my beloved sister, recommended a black woman therapist, as I dialed the number I felt the same despair and defeat I had felt from all the other calls I had made. She wasn't going to return my call. But lo and behold, she called me back the very next day. I cried the moment she introduced herself. And I know I said thank you repeatedly during our conversation. She saw me, she heard me. So a little less bullshit.
 
23:22  I have a journey ahead of me. This is a story from the wound, not from the scar. I believe grief will always be a scar. And I know that grief will forever be a part of me. I'm not the same person I was yesterday, a month ago, two months ago, or three years ago. But I know I feel better today than I did yesterday. A month ago, two months ago, three years ago. As a proud Afro Latina black woman, I embody the courage of my ancestors to put on my boots but heels in this case and wade through the bullshit and turn it into fertilizer to nourish my soul. I can be 100% for myself, 25 fabulously flawed percent for my two eldest children, 33% from my husband and my daughter, and I can be whatever percentage I need to be from my tribe. Momma, he's gone. But I'm calling grief what it is. And I call bullshit. 
(applause)

### 
 
JENETTE  24:53  So you never think when someone is in the depths of grief that they can be so Bright, so funny, so charming. And I think it all comes down to life, death, grief, all of it. Life can be ridiculous, all of it all of the crap we have to go through. And Luisa, you called it man, you called it what it was, and you made us laugh with you through that tears. So thank you.
 
LUISA  25:22  You're welcome. And what I did I think about the process of leading up to the show. And you know, you you work on your story, you tell your story, you tell your story. And then you get on the stage and you tell your story again. And I won't say it becomes like, second nature, but it's like you've told the story so many times, and then we you tell it to people who have not heard it, it takes you back. And then you realize, Wow, this is big. This is something that people need to talk about. This is something that people might not have worked for. But in the moment, you don't realize it until you step off that stage. And you start to interact with those. And you're like, wow, I mean, even afterwards, I have people coming up to me, and talking to me about it is that I remember, and I didn't have words for that. It's kind of like a different space. And I shared that with Jenette, like, Okay, you do it, you say you say it, but then when you do it the final time. And then you have to go within these spaces. It brings it all back like, wow,
 
KERRY  26:27  They're hearing it for the first time, using my Mom Brain and thinking, Okay, you have your own grief that you're wrestling. And then when you're a mom, now you're not only navigating that space for yourself, you are navigating that space for other loved ones, and especially if it's your child, that's a whole other level of navigating grief.
 
LUISA  26:49  Yes, that is and I think, for me, yes, I'm grieving, and it's hard. But as a mother, that's something I can't fix for my children. That's something I can't take away. That's not something that's in my power. And I just have to make sure that I am taking care of myself the best that I can, as I'm processing this grief, so that I can show up for them being the best version of myself, while they're grieving. And that place to be in it's, you know, you can appear one way or the other. And so I have to be intentional in not only my healing, I have to be intentional and how I show up for them.
 
KERRY  27:27  Wow, it was really moving. We talk a lot about how life is like Jeanette said ridiculous, and it's all the things and boy, in one piece you covered so much, you know, you talked about grief, you call bullshit. And it was sort of a roller coaster of all the different feelings we can have through situations like that. And you did it really beautifully.
 
JENETTE  27:45  Kerry and I often reflect on not sharing the story that is so new and so raw, because it can be dangerous, it can be harmful. And it can be just too much too much for the speaker too much for the audience. But what do you do when the trauma happens? After you've said yes, and you're in your story development phase, sometimes you can't ignore the brand new event that just happened. And so this was definitely outside of our normal path here. But Luisa and I talked about it and there was you shared with me a sense of like a need and an urgency that you had to take this moment to address what happened, you couldn't just ignore it and go on as if it didn't happen. And then your alternative was to not do the show at all, because you couldn't step out of you know this process. And so we chose we chose to dive in and brace it and use it as part of our story
 
KERRY  28:43  We always say tell tell your story from the scar and not the wound and a lot of that
 
LUISA  28:47  Yes
 
KERRY  28:47  ...is because we feel so we want to be gentle and careful with the speakers who are being so brave to do this. How do you feel now? Are you happy with that choice?
 
LUISA  28:58  Yeah, I am I am happy with that choice. And the reason why I am is it's actually a multitude of reasons. I'm proud that I was able to do it first and foremost. And I want to say thank you to Jenette for being gentle with me, and allowing the story to blossom the way it needed to. But you know, I appreciated that. And then I also knew I needed to say it, because I'm sure I'm not the only one and I found that out. So it was like this is too much not to talk about. Because it's so real. I'm glad I said it because other people might not sit back. Because how are you going to go to your partner and say, Hey, you, I love you. I'm with you. We ride or die. But I'm crumbling over here. And it's so easy to want to like not do that because you want to protect your partner. But I knew I had to stay it so I'm glad I set it for myself. I said I'm glad I set it for others. And I hope that one day when my youngest daughter is older and my grandchildren are older, they will be able to find this and they'll be able to see a glimpse of who I am. If nothing else, what I've learned since the passing of my ex, is that I'm telling the stories. I'm telling the stories, when my children call me and they are going through their struggles and their grieving and you know, coming up on the anniversary of his death, I am being a truth teller, a water carrier. And I'm telling our family stories, because so many people don't talk about the story. And we don't have that history. And I want them to know what it was like, what my life was like, what I went through where I am now, where I am now is not where I was 10 years ago, 20 years ago, when I was married to their father. So I'm tasking myself, in not having my mother here. I want to be that storyteller. And I want to share so I had many audiences that I wanted to read. And I think in just that moment, I was able to do that. And it was captured. It was eloquent. And I chuckled because of the title. Because my mother would probably blush, (laughter) My mother was a lady through and through those, the probably the oh my gosh, they're up there. Sorry, I call both. One thing my mother said to me, when was the last thing she said to me before she transitioned, she looked at me and she said, You are right with me. That told me that I can show up authentically, however I am, I am her tattooed child, I am her motorcycle riding child, I am the other things. And she saw in me, that little piece of like, a that's something out of like that done. And when she said I was alright with her, I knew I could go on with the rest of my life. And so I said, I'm gonna speak up when I'm asked to, I'm gonna even speak up when I'm not asked to. Because many times, we are silent and I refuse to be silent any longer.
 
JENETTE  31:55  Luisa, you couldn't have done it any other way, what a fortunate opportunity, the way you just described that it was almost like That's What She Said, gave you a time stamped moment, opportunity to record. This is where I am in this moment of time, as like a time capsule for you to have in the future. And for you to share it with your loved ones. I love how you expressed that. And that's a beautiful way to look at what we create. And the fortunate thing that we have technology to record these moments, because She Said is so powerful and magical in the moment. But thanks to technology, we can relive those moments. And so I think you're going to cherish this for many years to come. And now you get to cherish your episode of The She Said Project Podcast, which we're so grateful that you shared your time with us today.
 
LUISA  32:42  Yes, and I am so grateful for you having me here. I'm grateful for this platform for women. I am grateful that you know, we have these opportunities, and we're working with teens. And we're not going to set up, we're going to keep talking. And we're gonna keep taking over each community, each community, we're going to create spaces for these women to be able to tell their stories, because it's so powerful. It's so neat. It is historical. It's current, it's relevant. But one thing we can say is that no matter what it has to be done, and the work is being done, and it's been done beautifully. And it's been shared nationwide.
 
KERRY  33:25
Okay, did Jenette just put you on our payroll?
 
JENETTE JURCZYK  33:27  She read the script perfectly. I wrote that word for word earlier,
 
KERRY  33:32  Is this how we introduce our new marketing colleagues?
 
JENETTE  33:36  So yes, Luisa is our new PR person,
 
KERRY  33:39  You really you just took everything out of our hearts that like we would hope someone would feel and then you just put it into words.
 
JENETTE  33:44  And we're just getting started. Like I know we've been at this for more than 10 years now but it does sometimes feel like we're just getting started and so thank you for validating all that we do and hope to do with That's What She Said and the story sharing platform. So I want to thank our partners Illinois Public Media and our sponsors: Sterling Wealth Management, Carle and Health Alliance, our friends who make The She Said Project Podcast possible and our listeners and of course, the women who show up like Luisa Gomez, thank you for showing that you are the epitome of class and beauty and power. And I just admire you so much.
 
KERRY  33:47  Yep. You're all right with me.
 
LUISA  33:55  Well, you know what, I know how we can add the bullshit in. I will go ahead and stay for you.
 
KERRY  34:26  Oh go ahead.
 
LUISA  34:27  Each woman, any woman that has something to say, and you need to say it out loud and someone tells you no, it's bullshit.
 
KERRY  34:36  Call bullshit, ladies.
 
JENETTE  34:39  And that's a wrap!
 
KERRY  34:40  Over and out! 
###


[Music: The She Said Project Podcast Theme]
ANNOUNCER  34:45
Thank you for listening to The She Said Project Podcast in partnership with Illinois Public Media. All materials contained in the podcast for the exclusive property of The She Said Project and That’s What She Said, LLC. For more information on our live shows go to [url=https://shesaidproject.com]https://shesaidproject.com[/url]
 
This podcast was made possible with support from Carle and Health Alliance and presented by Sterling Wealth Management, empowering women to live their best lives.